Talk about a tough set of circumstances for Atlanta United going into this match against Real Salt Lake. Players leaving, rebuilds happening, away games on short rest, altitude…all against the Golden Boot front-runner in Chicho Arango…and they got punched in the mouth in the first minute. But the Five Stripes initially responded in a way in which Rob Valentino should be proud, and they took the game to RSL for a solid portion of the match. Ultimately, though, they left Utah on the bad end of the scoreline after a fluke goal, a moment of shambolic set piece defending, and then a complete come-apart. Here are your final whistle thoughts!
That mentality…until it wasn’t
Atlanta United just went out and played 90+ minutes of soccer against one of the better teams in the league this season, and against an attack that’s absolutely ruthless. They got blasted in the nose right from the opening whistle, but for the next 65 minutes they appeared completely unfazed as they picked their head up and took the game right back to Real Salt Lake. Then the second half happened.
It’s a completely intangible aspect of the game, mentality. But it’s so unbelievably crucial. Atlanta United showed glimpses of the ability to take charge of games under Gonzalo Pineda, but it was so inconsistent. Rob Valentino’s version of the Five Stripes is at least showing they can respond to adversity in a mature manner, and they did so once again tonight…for a while. That’s huge when the team is going through a massive transitionary period and oh….they had no Designated Players on the team sheet tonight.
If we want to pick out any problem on this Atlanta United squad, it’s simply that: they have no game changing players at the moment. It isn’t a knock on anyone on this squad, but the stats over MLS history show that a team without DP’s – or with bad ones – don’t do well. The front office has stated multiple times they’re looking to make moves in the summer transfer window, so we can only hope they hit the jackpot with the two open spots.
Dax McCarty and Bartosz Slisz
Going into this match, I felt Dax McCarty and Bartosz Slisz would be heavily focused on defensive duties. I was wrong. The build up for Atlanta was still primarily out on the wings, which was to be expected, but the midfield pairing did a phenomenal job battling Real Salt Lake’s own stout central grouping. They were involved in many attacking sequences, with Slisz included the first half Saba Lobjanidze goal.
For all the ups and downs the Five Stripes have endured this season, the midfield has been perhaps the best they’ve had since pre-Covid. I mentioned it on the podcast back before this grueling stretch of summer matches, but Dax McCarty could easily be the most important player for Atlanta through August. The team is better when he’s helping control the tempo, and even when he isn’t playing, he brings a huge veteran presence that Brad Guzan can’t provide alone. Bartek, for his part, has been a revelation in helping keep the defense as solid as it’s been, despite every setback imaginable.
If the front office can make the right summer moves and strengthen some very obvious holes, this team could make a run towards the playoffs. Bare minimum, they come back a better team in 2025. That doesn’t take the sting out of tonight, though.
Don’t pin this on Rob or anyone
At this point, Atlanta United is a victim of circumstance. Thiago Almada had to go; can you imagine the outrage if they kept him and then he ultimately left on a free? Giorgos Giakoumakis had to go (even if we didn’t expect it earlier this season). Gonzalo Pineda, with the bad results the team racked up earlier in the season, had to go.
Call a spade a spade, call a rebuild a rebuild, it’s fine. It happens. And Atlanta United is in one. Rob Valentino has led this team to some results he probably shouldn’t have, and he’s not quite pulled off some results in games he should’ve, but that’s soccer. He had an uphill battle from the get-go, and he can’t be judged with the roster the way it currently stands. Like I mentioned before, the front office has work to do.
SET PIECES
Again….I type these articles in real time so believe me when I say I’ve done a lot of undoing and retyping. But every point made above this one would have a lot more sway if Atlanta’s set piece defending (and attacking) were better. It hasn’t been good this season and Real Salt Lake made them pay…immensely. Anyway…this match unraveled in the final 25 minutes and the team simply hasn’t been good enough against genuinely solid MLS teams.
Let us know below what y’all thought about the match!
Seems to me with a couple of exceptions we continually have shorter players than other MLS teams. Granted fast, quick players are necessary to win. They also have to run constantly during the game so some 6-5” 240 lb monster isn’t going to make many rosters. That said Josef scored on many headers amongst much taller players but we’ve been having set piece issues for the last several years seems like.
I hope Valentino isn’t being seriously considered. I’m sure he’s a good guy, and you could argue roster again, but our good results as of late seem to be almost entirely from luck, and not any tactical prowess on Valentino’s part.
I wonder if the club was really caught off guard by how poorly we were performing under Pineda, and as a result, didnt already have a shortlist of candidates to consider.
I agree regarding Valentino. I think the club saying “we’ll back Rob to see what he can do for now” is just cover while they conduct a coaching search.
I’m less optimistic for 2025 because I struggle to see us sign a coach and all DPs by the start of the 2025 season. Maybe the plan is get a coach and 1-2 DPs and rely on next summer’s window too.
Its certainly possible to get this thing turned around for 2025. Will this front office be able to manage that? Im eternally hopeful, but certainly not counting on it.
OMG I truly hope it’s 2025…we’ve been “rebuilding” for 4 years…time to sh*t or get off the pot…
Agreed re:having a shortlist. But like you, Im surprised its still been quiet on that front.
based on GL’s history, Valentino is definitely going to be considered. You can look at Seattle and how they handled player acquisition and coaching hiring.
Rob Valentino is no Brian Schmetzer. Schmetzer had nearly 240 games experience over 7 seasons as head coach for Seattle when they were still USL. He was quite successful in that time.
I never said he was like Schmetzer, but Schmetzer was also an interim coach before getting hired as a full time coach for Seattle. So I could see a scenario if Valentino by some miracle gets Atlanta a couple rounds into the playoffs, he would definitely be in the consideration to be a the full time coach.
I am confused. Obviously, we using this transitional period to give the youngsters some experienced playing time. So why is Cohen on the bench? At this point, I don’t think Guzan’s vertical extension can exceed a few inches – what is the point?
Good game to completely miss on my part.
First, you may not have known that “calling a spade a spade” has racist roots. Humbly suggest you don’t use that phrase.
Second, wouldn’t it be better to get a manager in place and then let him have input on the players (DPs) to be selected (like Tata did during the build)? Seems backwards to get the players and hope they fit the new manager’s style. Even if it means ditching this season…
Actually, the phrase doesn’t have racist roots…the phrase has its origins in classical Greece and was translated as “spade” in the 16th century (ie. A kind of shovel). The usage of spade as a derogatory term didn’t happen until the early 20th century. So it’s not that the phrase has racist roots, it’s the meaning of words can sometimes shift over time and in this case, some might misconstrue the phrase as racist.
https://www.npr.org/sections/codeswitch/2013/09/19/224183763/is-it-racist-to-call-a-spade-a-spade
Yes, but it’s fun to be outraged.
Thanks for the article. It was an interesting read for someone who didn’t even know about the possible issues with the phrase. Though to be fair to the original poster, the author ends the article urging caution in using the phrase and quotes an academic who suggests it should just be retired.
I remember your user name so I don’t know why you don’t know this, but Atlanta United’s thing is that Carlos Bocanegra gets all the players without any input from anybody so that when/if the team wins something, he can claim 100% of the credit. Thus, there is no need to worry about what a future manager may want in terms of players because the whole org is set up for that to not matter one bit and for Boca’s opinion to be the final one and in some cases the only one. This is why Rob V will likely get the permanent manager’ job – he doesn’t have the status to push back on Boca. Until Garth cares enough to stop this crap by firing Boca, it doesn’t really matter who the manager is and nobody who is notable is ever going to take the job here – if by some miracle they were offered it – because nobody good wants to work for a TD/GM who isn’t interested in input from others.
Tata is gone because he couldn’t get along with Boca and Boca HATED Tata telling him what players to get, even if Tata was usually right.
An interesting fact that you may not be aware of is that repeating your fever dream insanity over and over again doesn’t make it any less false.
You are so spot on – unfortunately, most don’t know the Boca history with his organization.
Many of the names here have been following with Dirty South Soccer for years. We’re all familiar with the Boca history.
We’re not doubting that Boca has done some stupid stuff, including chasing off good, important people from this team. What we’re tired of hearing from Zontar (as he has done multiple years with multiple things) is taking things to a conspiracy level, stating opinions as fact, and ignoring facts as opinions.
Sorry, but this is 100% on Rob for me.
AUFC has never played a 3-4-3 well, and attempting it against this team, in this stadium, on short rest, was just a baffling string of decisions. It then took far, far too long to admit/realize the situation and get the homegrowns on the field to get some valuable playing time and possibly pull something out of their youthful exuberance. That probably should have been the plan from the start, but I guess Rob was wanting to keep the fresh for Tuesday? Regardless, just a very poor showing from the manager. It was never going to be great but it absolutely could have been better.
Also, Saba is a DP. Yes he is presumably at a level that could be bought down if needed but he has the tag so it’s objectively wrong (and a bit insulting) to say we have “zero DPs” on the field.
Agreed on the issues with the tactical decision.
One update though, Saba is no longer a DP. He was bought down to make Gregersen a TAM-eligible DP. https://mlssoccer.app.box.com/s/e8eu9jpgtk09j03ynasb6zpd6hur37yk
With Atlanta’s current personnel, 3-4-3 is probably the best formation because we don’t have an attacking MF. Saba could probably play it, but I guess Valentino does not want to do that, for whatever reason.
It was always highly, highly unlikely we were going th get any kind of result in this game. Given that, seems like not a bad time to try something new formation wise and see what you learn from it.
Only watched the first 5 minutes since Brazil was playing Uruguay. I’m really losing interest on this team…. I think. Not too motivated to watch them or going to MB. I’ll have to watch the whole game to see how we really did but giving up 5 goals means we are an ocean apart from the MLS elite teams. Sad to see. I know we have to rebuild but how come LAFC can rebuild but not hit the bottom?
A team that never gelled with its star talent was down three DP level players on the road at one of the best teams in the league.
I agree with you, but Miami did lose by 5 to Cinci… so “MLS Elite” is relative and week-by-week
Well, Brazil did not do that much better either. Lots of debates here on where we are going. It is clear we don´t have a team, but a collection of very different talents. I am not sure there is Brazilian coach who can do the job of building a competitive team, even with all the talent available. And this is similar to what is going on with the USMNT, right?
At team level, I think my dear Atlantistas would be better off admitting there is no Atlanta FC, not yet, not in 2024. There is nothing to judge, or think of, only something to be expected, following the hiring of a coach, and intense hiring of new players. As is, there is nothing.
Miami, well, I think Tata got this game wrong. This time he was too far below mininum threshold, he did not have the least conditions to play, and he should have parked all the buses and gone for a result. It was clear this was a game he could not play, and yet he tried. Strange decision.
Anyway, this loss was expected, only the score is a consequence of being too careless, or ambitious. It really doesn´t mean much, as a full Miami would have been a completely different story, and a championship is all about the average.
Hope you get a coach, hope we get a coach, and life can reestart.
Agree with your evaluation of Brazil. Honestly, I have been very disappointed with their play for the last several years. I’ve said it before: too many players from overseas; there is no team; there is no Brazilian football. What Brazil meant to me is no longer present
Agree.
This game was our 2023 season wrapped up into one scorelines: An amazing attack that is held back by our hopeless defense.
I ask if this is a winning culture? If it is then this would be a celebration when we call next man up.
String together a few wins and the “culture” will follow. Culture is handwaving. Build a roster and the wins will come. Wins come, and the fans return. Fans return and any question of “culture” becomes redundant.
Saw that one coming. Plenty of blame to go around. It will be fun watching the full implosion over the rest of the season.
great punt job, now we can focus on Tuesday
Garth Lagerway has this summer and the end of season transfer window to right this ship. If he doesn’t, and he keeps the business model of making money off buying/selling players vs putting together a winning team, “Atlanta United” will go down in history as the fastest sinking ‘new sports franchise’ in history (the money will dry up quick next year if he doesn’t). That’s not a prediction or a threat, it’s a reality.
P.S. – please get rid of Boca while you’re at it!
Boca should be in jail for the suffering I’ve had to endure over the past 5 years.
He said for fans to judge him by the results of the last 2 windows.
Well…
Judge, jury, and executioner have spoken… time to GO!!
The last two windows (summer and winter 2023):
Three solid midfielders (Slisz, Muyumba, McCarty)
Two backup strikers who know how to score more than 1 wondergoal a season (Thiare, Rios)
Two great CBs (Stian, Williams)
Two dynamic wingers (Xande, Saba)
Desperately needed veteran leadership (McCarty, Williams, Rios)
A great backup keeper who is ready and able to step in for Guz next season (Cohen)
It is very possible, even likely, that he will be a second sacrificial lamb on the altar of “Doing Things To Change” just like Pineda was. That said, in the last two windows he has done nothing obviously wrong from a roster building standpoint. And he negotiated two, possibly three, very high value transfers that will give the team an unprecedented war chest with which to recruit their next DPs.
100%. On paper, what we have seen from the front office has been encouraging. It hasn’t materialized consistently on the field yet but with a new coach with a clear vision and the backing of a robust analytics and scouting department, we could be on our way to a consistent and sustainable club.
They’re not interested in facts. They’re up in their feelings again.
Reasonable. Unfortunately reason is typically not the driving force when the pitchforks and torches come for the scapegoats.
Boca has done better the last two windows. I think that mostly coincides with AU finally getting a robust analytics department that identifies players worth pursuing. I give more credit to them than Boca.
Boca used to be the guy picking players and closing deals. Now, he’s (I think) just the closer. AU is better for it, at least on paper.
Results on the field have not yet followed. I think much of this is due to a coach in over his head (Pineda and now Valentino) who could not find a way to adjust when his tactics were not working or figure out a way to play to his roster’s strengths. When the same problems keep rearing their ugly head, and your talent is objectively good enough, it’s coaching.
Hopefully we get a new coach with credentials and a clear vision as well as the flexibility to adjust to the talent available, and replace our departing DPs with MLS XI-level talent. Everything else is in place.
Well , everybody has a different theory on how it works but nobody really knows. We are all guessing. Regardless of how it really works, I worry about getting new players and then the new coach doesn’t play them correctly.
Yep, I am just guessing, admittedly. I have no insider knowledge, just trying to use Occam’s Razor for the AU stubble.
Pretty sure the expansion of the analytics department has coincided closely with the better signings of late.
I would love an optometrist recommendation, because basically all of those pieces you highlighted played last night and we got stomped. Im just not seeing much cause for optimism.
Also, those players you listed need to be taken into consideration with this window’s outgoings, which so far include GG and Almada.
Regarding comments elsewhere in the thread, the Boca Out stuff is more than just cathartic handwaving.
1. “We have good pieces; we just need a coach.” Well who is the guy that hires coaches that has put us in a situation in which we need a coach? I think Garth is leading the coaching search this time around, fortunately.
2. “It’s not Boca’s fault GG and Almada wanted to leave.” Yeah maybe not directly, but its his job to manage all parts of the roster simultaneously, from DPs to TAM players to other key pieces to supporting cast. If the stars never have a supporting cast or a supporting cast never has any stars, it eventually is his fault.
3. “He’s done good since the analytics department resumed.” So good that we are going to need 1-2 additional windows after this summer to complete a rebuild?
Hasn’t Boca had long enough to get us back on course?
Arguably more importantly, do we think that this time he will finally get it all right?
Please don’t (if you were) confuse my saying we’ve gotten a few better players lately as an endorsement of Boca. It’s not – it’s an indictment of him that we’ve only done a little better in player acquisition since we got an analytics department.
We need a couple windows mostly because we’ve had 2 DPs leave at about the same time (one we knew was leaving, the other apparently didn’t want to be here any more) and perhaps Caleb will be gone soon too. But even that’s not the biggest problem, IMHO.
What we didn’t have, and still don’t, is a top-level manager to put it all together. Hoping one comes with two new MLS XI-level DPs. I am encouraged to hear that Garth is heading up the coaching search this time around, though I worry about him naming Valentino as a viable candidate.
I think you can argue a lot of things, but results are objective. It is clear that the system did not work, and is not working. An analytics departament, to get these players? Seriously?
There is no team, and the reason Almada and Big Greek Guy wanted to go is because Atlanta failed them, and a player´s life is too short.
Atlanta has a very uninpressive collection of B players, and it does need a lot of talent of capacity to find, and hire them. But they can´t lead a team to results, because they are B players, and need to be added to a well trained team, with enough A players to be competitive.
The current system, with new president, has been as ineffective as the previous system post Tata. You need to be able to hire a top level coach, and then listen to the guy.
I think in MLS you need a collection of B to B+ players – serviceable guys that are better than MLS-average. Your A guys are the DPs. The cap rules don’t generally allow for an all-star team, unless you are Miami. MLS is a minor league on the World Stage.
Agree that you need a good coach to bring it all together, and it is clear we have not had that. The results, despite having better overall talent, speak for themselves.
Disagree about the reason Almada wanted to go. There is no universe where Almada (barring, knock on wood, catastrophic injury) would have been content to stay here, regardless of the results. He always had Big 4 League ambitions and talent, and AU helped him get there.
As for the Greek Bricklayer, he has a bit of history of doing well one year then demanding his salary be re-negotiated. He apparently did that with us. Hindsight is 20-20, and I may be dealing with some confirmation bias here, but looking back on the season, GG seemed a lot more frustrated on the pitch even though the team performance wasn’t a lot different. Can’t help but wonder if his dissatisfaction with his contract affected his play (though injury affected it more).
It’s fun to say BocaOut over and over and over because it makes it sound like you know things and all the others who really don’t know that much say it back. It’s like a secret handshake that everyone knows.
That’s cute seeing that I never said Boca Out, so all your comment has really shown is that you don’t know how to read.
But I’ll be clear, and spell it out. I don’t care if Boca is gone or not. These past windows with Garth have shown to me the opposite of Boca’s quest to prove he was and is key to the team’s success. Sure, if managed properly, he can provide positives to the team. But before that time, while Boca was effectively on his own, he effectively blew up the 2017-19 squad, and then hired a string of bad managers and players that has led to this team to constantly underperform and be in salary cap hell. Things which we are still clearly paying for today. So yeah, I stand by the view that Boca is the source for the suffering that comes from watching this team the past 5 years.